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Protein utilization
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John Burns
Posted 6/23/2024 20:50 (#10785071 - in reply to #10784897)
Subject: some coments



Pittsburg, Kansas

I agree that there are some differing ideas among the community and the doctors.

First off that video is three years old. I thought it had some good information so I posted it. I think in general he gives pretty good information and I have listened to him on and off for 5 years now. I don't listen to nearly all of his presentations because there are several others that I like better and there are only so many hours in a day. He may have slightly different opinions on certain things after three years. When I first started watching him he was heavily leaning towards plants with meat being good too but seems like he really pushed the plants in the diet. His latest stuff I don't see that nearly as much and he is emphasizing the importance of meat protein.

About that protein. The best study and presentation I have seen was by Professor Bikman. He had the numbers and the charts. Fat gave almost no insulin response. Meat protein alone gave a very small bump but nothing compared to what the carbs did at many times the amount protein did.

Now here is the caveat. It depends on the fed state. If a person is fed carbohydrates WITH the protein, you get the full carb insulin spike PLUS the protein as an additive. So if a person is eating low carb excess meat protein will not likely express very much of an insulin spike. But if you eat it with carbs it will. That is the nuance and if you look at studies that show protein adding a lot of insulin what they call a low carb diet may not be low carb at all. Some studies call 100-150 grams of carbs a day a low carb diet. Well I guess it is low compared to 300 grams a day but no low carb doctor or practitioner would call 100 grams carbs low carb.

According to Bikman from his own lab studies and the vast number of studies he reads he doesn't think meat protein should even be assigned a calorie amount. According to him protein takes so much energy for the body to process it has hardly any excess from its consumption other than the energy it requires to be digested.

Another important caveat is metabolism rate. If you cut calories the body knows it. Some people have had better luck eating MORE than less as long as they ate the correct foods (not carbohydrates). I can't quote nor locate the study easily but they found about a 300 calorie difference in metabolic rate difference in metabolism. If a person starts reducing calories the body will recognize it and lower metabolism. So a person wants to keep the energy input the same, at least to begin with. Just source the energy from fat instead of carbs. Bikman says the body can not store fat in a state of low insulin. It is hard to over eat meat protein and fat. Satiety will kick in and you will just push it away. It is common to actually go up in calorie intake early on, then as the body adjusts to the new normal it will naturally cut back on the calories. That is what Westman (I think it was him) and a couple of other doctors say. Don't worry about calories. Eat until you are satisfied. Just don't eat the wrong things that spike insulin. The calorie reduction if needed will come about with satiety later naturally.

At least that is the way I understand it. It has worked for me and I eat like a pig. But my wife lost about half of what she would like and stalled out there. So different people are different it seems. Women in general seem to have some more difficulty.

Here is a five minute one from Bikman on the subject. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zij9LQQYVU

Here is the presentation at Low Carb Down under from 6 years ago where I first learned that information about protein. It is great and still relevant. I listened to that presentation probably around five and a half years ago shortly after he gave it at a Low Carb Down Under meeting. That was kind of his beginning and first exposure to the low carb community. He has become a rock star ever since. He has found that he can reach thousands of students as a Professor. But he can reach millions with his ground breaking research through social media. He truly is a hero to me and should be to any diabetic or future diabetic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3fO5aTD6JU

If three low carb doctors are in the room and two of them disagree with Bikman, I will go with Bikman. He doesn't speak of things he has little knowledge of. I can't remember him every over hyping something and he is pretty good about differentiating what is his opinion from what he thinks he knows by the research available and considers to be factual. Here is a search that will have a bunch of good information.
 https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=benjamin+bikman+prioritize+protein






Edited by John Burns 6/23/2024 21:03
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